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Käännös - Ruotsi-Latina - Du har inte levt förän du har hittat nÃ¥got att dö för.

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Tämä teksti on saatavilla seuraavilla kielillä: RuotsiLatina

Otsikko
Du har inte levt förän du har hittat något att dö för.
Teksti
Lähettäjä freddee000
Alkuperäinen kieli: Ruotsi

Du har inte levt förän du har hittat något att dö för.

Otsikko
Nec antequam aliquid morte dignum inveneris, vives.
Käännös
Latina

Kääntäjä Aneta B.
Kohdekieli: Latina

Nec antequam aliquid morte dignum inveneris, vives.
Huomioita käännöksestä
morte / moriendo

Bridge by gamine:
" You have not lived before you have found something to to die for."
Viimeksi tarkastanut tai toimittanut chronotribe - 24 Kesäkuu 2009 00:55





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19 Kesäkuu 2009 12:39

chronotribe
Viestien lukumäärä: 119
Wouldn't it rather be :

Nec ante uixeras quam aliquid...

As regards tenses, this construction with ante/quam is pretty difficult, and I'm not sure whether pluperfect and perfect is right. My 'Latin feeling' would be putting the whole sentence in future:
Nec ante uiues quam aliquid inueneris (fut perf)...


19 Kesäkuu 2009 16:02

Aneta B.
Viestien lukumäärä: 4487
"Nec ante uiues quam aliquid inueneris (fut perf)..."

Dear chronotribe.
I would translate your version this way:

You won't be living until you find...

Look: the source deals with past tense, not future.

19 Kesäkuu 2009 20:58

Aneta B.
Viestien lukumäärä: 4487
The sentence from my dictionary:
"nec antequam vires deerant, expugnati sunt"
-They were not defeated, until they got weak (Livius?)

You can compare now
I've corrected my translation a bit.Pluperfect was not right here as you thought.
I agree it's especially difficult construction, but we can cope with it, I believe.

21 Kesäkuu 2009 18:36

chronotribe
Viestien lukumäärä: 119
Actually I've used the future 'on purpose', so as to translate a past sentence, because I doubt it could be literally translated:

'You have not lived before you have found something to to die for' deals (as regards its meaning) with future. In French we could turn it this way (in past tense) but in Latin, I think we must do according to the meaning (just feeling, I know, but I haven't found any exempla with a similar meaning in past tenses, whereas I've found some in future).

I've got to leave right now (very busy these days!), but I'll send you some others comments in a while...

21 Kesäkuu 2009 22:05

Aneta B.
Viestien lukumäärä: 4487
Hm. Present Perfect in English is connected with past, says about finished activities, but ok. Maybe I am wrong

If it should be in future, how about 'Nec antequam aliquid morte dignum inveneris, vives'?

22 Kesäkuu 2009 21:01

chronotribe
Viestien lukumäärä: 119
Of course it is presented as finished activities, but all I wanted to say (I haven't been very clear I know) is that 'You have not lived before you have found something to die for' does not have to do with past (mainly as regards its meaning, of course not exactly in a grammatical point of view) in a same way as, for instance, 'You hadn't opened the door before you found the keys' or even 'You haven't taken the keys, so you can't open the door'. In fact I'm neither an English speaker (as you know it well) nor a specialist in linguistics, so that my opinions are to some extent uncertain and can't be guaranteed.
Anyway, the more I think about this, the less certain I get. I realize I wasn't accurate enough when I said the sentence 'deals with future'. It isn't really the point. As a matter of fact, does this sentence (as regards its meaning, I insist on it) deal with a specific temporality? Just as 'you' in this sentence doesn't really mean 'you' (it's an indefinite second person, meaning 'one' or 'anyone'), 'to live' doesn't really mean 'to live' in the literal sense of the word, but 'to live one's life to the full'; so I think verbal processes that are expressed in this sentence do not refer to a specific temporality (past, present, or future) but have to be understood as in a indefinite time, as well as timeless actions in the gnomic/omnitemporal present tense.

Indeed, is there any difference of meaning between 'You have not lived before you have found something to die for', 'You won't live before you'll have found something to die for' or 'you don't live before you have found something, etc.'?

If you agree with me on that (to put it briefly: it's a gnomic sentence), then we can go forward to this other question: how must we properly render its meaning in Latin?

Regarding this question, I would answer that past tenses don't seem to be suitable, according to exempla I've found...

I think 'Nec antequam aliquid morte dignum inveneris, vives' is right, whereas 'Nec antequam aliquid morte dignum invenisti, vivebas' isn't, because in this way, it can't be understood as a gnomic sentence (timeless), but only as a real process in the past. (Moreover, I doubt 'inuenisti' could work here like 'deerant' (= were coming to be deficient.)



22 Kesäkuu 2009 21:22

Aneta B.
Viestien lukumäärä: 4487
You're right chronotribe. It is a gnomic and timeless sentence indeed like most of proverbial sentences are. Thanks for drawing my attention to this issue. Don't be so modest! You're Latin specialist indeed. For me for sure
Anyway, I'm glad that the second proposition of mine you've accepted. I've already edited the translation.

22 Kesäkuu 2009 21:40

lilian canale
Viestien lukumäärä: 14972
Hi chronotribe, Hi Aneta

If I may give my two cents...the correct version in English should be:

"You won't have lived before you find something to die for"

22 Kesäkuu 2009 21:58

Aneta B.
Viestien lukumäärä: 4487
And now all is clear! Thanks a lot, Lilly! Chronotribe thought just in this way about this sentence. His speculations were going in this right ditrection. Smart man!
My translation reflects your English version, I think.

24 Kesäkuu 2009 00:56

chronotribe
Viestien lukumäärä: 119
Good news Language is a great puzzle!

24 Kesäkuu 2009 01:01

Aneta B.
Viestien lukumäärä: 4487
Yes, it is indeed! Unbelievable!