Traduction - Farsi-Persan-Anglais - مرده شور

Well, I know there is a lot of Arabic in Persian, this phrase is 100% Persian. "Mordeh" = dead person, "shur" = washer (from the Persian verb shostan / شستن ). So, "mordeh-shur" is the person whose job it is to wash dead bodies. In colloquial Persian, this phrase can be used to curse someone (go to hell, f-off or more literally, Go die!) or to just curse in general (dammit, sh-t...). It is vulgar.

It is short for one of the following sentences: "مرده شور او را ببرد " مرده شور تو را ببرد " ... "that the 'dead body washer' take you/it/him/her away"... You say it to someone who made you mad, or in a situation that makes you mad.

Yes, I agree. There is a big difference between Persian and Arabic, and I certainly don't know enough to judge this (I speak Arabic and my friends, from Persia, have confirmed what you wrote here as being the case. Do you have a direct quote to tell a person "go to hell" or is it always implied? In any case I think the English is fine and have put it up for a vote. I would, however, like to get at least one of our language experts to look it over and vote on it.

I'm not a Farsi expert dramati - I think you should simply put it to a vote. Note of the administrators can read Farsi, so asking for administrative help will not do any good here.

The problem being that no one is voting on it, since nobody seems sure about the Persian.

I just asked Talebe on the Arabic page and he says that there is a difference between "مرده شور" and "مرده شو" (without the last letter), he says the first is "dead washer" the second is "be dead" or "go to hell"
does that mean anything to you slfauver?
oh and by the way, dramati, i cant recognize that as Arabic, how is it possible?

Hi Elmota -

Yes, مرده شو literally means "become a dead person."

But, it is not a common expression.

Yes, مرده شور is literally "dead person washer." But, it is used as the short version of مرده شور تو را ببرد or مرده شور او را ببرد. (Literally, "that the dead person washer take you away" or "that the dead person washer take him/her/it away."

It's a common expletive in Persian. If it is directed at someone it's meaning is closer to "Go die..." but if you want to match it with a common American/English expletive I think "Go to hell" is the closest.

If it's not directed at anyone in particular, it's closer to "Oh, sh-t/d_mn" etc.

السلام عليكم جميعا
elmota انا اكتب بالعربي (لأنني لا أعرف الانكليزية جيدا) وأنت تترجمينها إلى الانكليزية (لو ممكن) لأن هذا منتدى للترجمة
كان يكتب في القاموس الفارسي بأن معنى (مرده شور) و (مرده شوي) و (مرده شو) كلهم بمعنى (غاسل الميت).ومع هذا (مرده شو) كما قلت أنا و كما قالت slfauver لها معنى آخر يعني (كن ميتا).وأما ما قالته slfauver بأن (مرده شو) لا يستعمل بمعنى إذهب إلى الجحيم صحيح.هذا لا يوجد في الاصطلاح.
أما (مرده شور) بهذه الحالة المجردة عن الكلمات و القرائن الدالة على أنها بمعنى (إذهب إلى الجحيم) لا يمكن أن نقول بأن معناها (إذهب إلى الجحيم).
أما القرائن الدالة على أنها بمعنى (إذهب إلى الجحيم) و مكونتها مصطلحا بهذا المعنى هي كلمة (ببرد).فإذا نجرد ونقول (مرده شور) كما هو المطلوب في الترجمة يجب أن نقول بأن معناه (غاسل الميت).وإذا تبحثون في جوجل للصور بمرده شور وحدها ستجدون هناك من يغسل الميت.
والخلاصة:أظن يجب أن نكتب في الترجمة (غاسل الميت) و في الملاحاظات حول الترجمة ما كتبته الأخت slfauver.
وأعتذر للجميع بسبب الإطناب.

شکرا, Talebe! You're right - we could just write the literal translation, "dead person washer" (I don't know the technical term for this in English, though) - since we don't know the context - and then write a note below the translation that talks about the alternate translations.

The term would be undertaker

If someone were to call someone else an undertaker in English, the other person would have no idea s/he was being insulted. As for "diener", this is not a term I've ever heard in English. If this is commonly understood to mean "Go to hell" in Farsi, then that is how it should be translated (with an explanation underneath).

Well you are probably correct, but it could also simply be "I hope you die".. I am not sure that Persion doesn't have an expression like go to hell. It seems strange since I am sure there is a persion word for hell, just as there is in every language...heaven and hell...universal concepts.

yes i agree with the decision made at last whatever that is although talib says that the word up their is not used as the expression and i undersand that slfauver agrees, so maybe the plain translation be the main one, and the alternative expression be dropped in the comments below
urnamo u could help if u tell us where u heard that?
kafe: diener is german i suppose
and finally, that does remind me of Arabic expressions like: sam el haree, which means the deadly poison, implicitly it means: i wish u eat a deadly poison
(this is just great)

CC: talebe

Actually, I like dramati's suggestion of "I hope you die" - I agree that there must be an expression for "go to hell" in Farsi. Hell = jehennem?

As for "diener", elmota if you click on the word in casper's message above, you'll see that he was referring to an obscure English usage of the word. Of course I'm familiar with the German word - it just means "servant".

handyy, you may want to change the Turkish translation according to the new version.

CC: handyy

evet, "geberirsin inşallah" daha güzel olurdu lol

smy,tercümenin son hali acaba neden ''I hope you die'' oldu.ben bişey anlamadım bu işten.
(ingilizce bilmemek çok kötü gerçekten)

selam talebe
Yukarıdaki tartışmaları sana şöyle özetleyebilirim:
Farsça'da "mordeh-shur", mota mot çevrilirse, "ölü yıkayıcısı" demekmiş ama konuşma dili Farsça'sında kullanılan "ölüy yıkayıcı seni alsın götürsün" deyiminin kısaltması olarak kullanılıyormuş, o yüzden bunu İngilizce'deki karşılığına yaklaştırmaya çalışmışlar ve şimdiki hali "I hope you die (geber(irsin) inşallah)" ama altınada da alternatif çevirisi olan "cehenneme git"i koymuşlar.
aşağıdaki söylediklerim onlara yönelik
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the above explanation was for talebe who does not understand what you are talking in English, and he wonders why the last version of the translation is "I hope you die" now, so I've summed all your discussions up for him but maybe someone wants to make an explanation in Arabic

teşekkürler. şimdi oldu

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