번역 - 영어-이탈리아어 - Drink Russian, drive German, wear Italian, kiss...

In italiano sarebbe più corretto bevi come i russi, guida come i tedeschi...

My Italian maybe is not so good, but I don't agree with this translation, sorry.

If English original was:
"Drink in Russian way, drive in German way..." etc. we indeed could translate it as "alla russo, alla tedesco..."
If it was "Drink like a Russian, drive like a German..." it could go--> "come i russi", come i tedeschi"

But we have here "Drink Russian, drive German..."etc... So, may it go: "Bevi russo, guida tedesco, vesti italiano, bacia francese"?

Lilian suggested above it should have been interpreted as follows: "Bevi (una cosa) russa, guida (una cosa) tedesca, vesti (una cosa) italiana, bacia (una persona) francese"?
But what is in brackets is only default. So...

Lilian asked the requester to clarify the meaning, but s/he hasn't answered yet.

Moreover, "Bevi russo" makes sense to me, as it means "Drink Russian (drinks)". But "bacia francese" doesn't make any sense to any Italian mothertongue.

The difficult thing is to catch what the requester wanted to say, as this sentence can have many interpretations (I see there are problems with Russian translations, for example). I think we should wait for the requester's reply.

How do you call a French person in your country, Alex? "Francese" is an adjective, but can it be sometimes used like it was a noun? Or do you have any noun made from the adjective? If not, the translation should be "bacia una persona francese" I guess.
In Polish it would be "Francuz" (French person) and the noun came from an adjective "francuski" (French). So "kiss French" in Polish would be "Całuj Francuza".

But, of course, some explanations of the requester are needed. They can show the true meaning of the problematic sentence. So, let's wait...

Yes, of course "francese" means both "French" and "Frenchman". But "bacia francese" looks like incorrect, since everyone would put an article ( "il" o "un" ) between "bacia" and "francese".

But I thought the meaning of the sentence was "the Russian way", "the German way" etc.
And "Bevi russo" can also mean "Drink the Russian way". Unfortunately at the moment we cannot know whether my interpretation is correct or not.

To bring my two cents, I'd say the last proposition (the French one) from this text is not about an item, while the three others are.

So the Italian way to say it might be the one Alex suggested (with "alla"
Replace gentilés by trades, you can do that for the three first propositions (eg : Drink Smirnoff, drive Mercedes, wear Rinascimento...), but for the last one, which is an action, you'll have to add something to indicate it is not about an item, but about an action.

The English original text may be willing to line the French kiss up with an item, (as if all the French were kissing the same way, ha!). Maybe English is flexible enough, simple enough, to stay correct with just using the adjective or gentilé, but IMO if it sounds weird to Alex or Serena it means it is not employed in Italian.

It is obviously about items, right? (a German doesn't drive better than a French, they just are supposed to build more solid cars in Germany! )

<edit> "Absolute" with "Smirnoff", as "Absolute" is a Swedish trade!</edit>

I agree with Francky5591.

CC: Francky5591 Efylove

Buvez a la russe, conduisez comme un allemand, habillez comme italien, et embrassez a la francaise.

AFAH, this is the exact opposite from what I just tried to explain (about the three first propositions)

If it were what you said, in English it would read differently :

"Drink the Russian way, drive the German way, dress the Italian way and kiss the French way", and the four propositions would be similar.

Hello!

I see this text isn't an easy one, and this is because English doesn't need a noun in front of the adjective, but the other languages need one, Romanian for example. You simply can't give the exact meaning, if indeed the real meaning is "Drink Russian *beverage*, drive German *car*, wear Italian *clothes*, kiss *the French way*." Usually after a verb comes an adverb. In Romanian I was obliged to put an adverb which can mean both: drink the Russian way, or drink like Russians (like Russians: what do Russians drink? vodka and not only, of course, they also drink kvas :P), so there is a chance to understand it wrongly... The first two can be misunderstood, the last two are clear: wear Italian. Italian like adverb, it is clear that you "wear Italian (style clothes)", it's like "eat Italian".

I left the exact meaning in the notes field, but if in the end is decided that all the translations, at least the ones in the languages that really need a noun in front, the whole ratio source text:translation will be changed probably, there will be more characters than the ones in the original.

Most probably the meaning is the one we already know: first three are about things, the last about way, one evidence is that I saw a longer version of it on the net: besides the four parts, it also had "Smoke Cuban (cigarres)"

So, let me know if smth needs to be changed in the completed translation (s)...

Why can't all the texts be easily translatable?

Italian native speakers assumed "alla" was necessary before "francese", I think we should trust native speakers (experts in Italian moreover).

When the original text is not clear enough, there are always different opinions expressed about its meaning in the discussion area, which does the validation is belated.

I didn't say anything about the translation in Italian, each expert knows best the feature of his native language, it's just that some texts are way too discussed. You usually just have to find the form that conveys best the original meaning, being known that everyone agrees on an only meaning. There are times when the text is just uncertain in both original and translation, and you can't have a clear translation when the text can have more meanings.

Clear text = clear translation.

Dear All!
Let me thank again Francky5591 and Freya for their last explanations, which confirm what was already clear: Alexfatt made the best possible translation of this text.
But the true reason why I thought to write here again is just to try to give my personal contribution to a final note in one of Freya's last messages - and we are just in this case today: why a translation of many texts is not so easy or immediate at all? Everybody knows that the English word "translation" derives directly from the latin verb "Trans-fero" (I move/I "take through". Of course we cannot "transferre" only words, which would make a translation a simple mechanic action, but we have to use and put a series of further elements, such as the ways of telling things acording to the habits, the culture, the tradition of countries and nations. If a translation would have been only a mechanic action we could have easily used a computer or some "translating machines", but this is not the case. This is why in a translation we always have to put something of our own: experience, education, good knowledge of one or more languages - including the native one -, sensitiveness...
I think that this site is the right place where we can improve not only something we try to do, but ourselves too.
Sorry if this message has been too long this time, but I could not resist to take this opportunity to express my interest for this site and my thankfulness to you all who make it work so well


CC: Freya Francky5591 AFAH

No need for sorry, Maybe. You "saved the day". I also thank you.

Yes, and in English is also this number "incertitude": drive German, for example, can be drive a German car, or drive German cars (because they are best). It can be interpreted in more ways and everyone is right from his point of view....

Thanks for your input; Maybe:-)!

Freya, you began your post by "I didn't say anything...", as if my preview post was addressed to you, but it wasn't, I posted to say in a more general way that Alex's translation is right and should be validated.

This shows the necessity for us admins to leave a text be translated only when its meaning is undestandable the same way by everybody, and our rules 6 and 7 are clear about this. The requester shoud have left an equivalent or an explanation in the remarks field, in order to let possible translators understand well what it was about "Kiss French" (review the discussion and you'll see it was far from being obvious to understand, even the best among us did err about the meaning! )

I also have another sample with a text in Russian where only one word ("termin" was not understandable, and it is now stuck at the evaluation, noboby being able to assume the translation from this word is right. The right thing to do, when in doubt, is setting the text in stand-by and ask the requester to give more context. If the requester does not reply, the request is to be removed. And I did the error to release this text, that was in "meaning only".

Let's validate this translation Alex did, now that there isn't anymore doubt about its meaning.

For no more headaches from now on, the texts that don't have a clear meaning should be put in stand-by and the requester asked about his text and if he doesn't have a clue either, it should simply be removed. But this would mean that every single text, here I mean the longer ones, should be checked by an admin or the expert in that language. One problem is that there are quite many texts in languages that no admin understands and the experts don't check them either, until the last moment and then the translation has to be rejected...but well, these are administrative matters. Usually people translate texts that have more meanings and they get only one of them. Only if the text is completely uncertain, only then they stop: if the problem is only a word they won't stop usually. That's the problem, unfortunately and from these kind of words or more meanings "a war of the opinions begins" between members...

I feel like thanking you very much for your continuous and profitable contribuition, guys.
Thank you all!

I am of the same mind: translations are not to be done mechanically, because we have to transfer feelings and emotions, rather than words, from a language to another.

I think now I can accept this translation of mine, can't I?

CC: Freya Francky5591 Efylove

I validated your translation Alex.
This way, you have a rating

Thank you so much, Francky!!!