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Die Schlusszeile entspricht ebensogut denen aus...

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milkman

Originalo kalba: Vokiečių

Die Schlusszeile entspricht ebensogut denen aus "Von Himmel hoch"; von letzterem stimmt zudem die zweite Zeile fast vollstÃ¤ndig Ã¼berein, auÃŸerdem enthÃ¤lt auch er Kurzzeilen, die allerdings mit ihren Ruf-Terzen melodisch abweichen. Kurzzeilen sind durchaus nicht ungewÃ¶hnlich; sie erscheinen beispielsweise such in "Was Gott tut, "Wachet auf", "Straf mich nicht", "Mache dich, mein Geist" und "Herzlich lieb hab ich dich". Als allgemein anerkanntes Vorbild fÃ¼r die erste Zeile gilt "Was mein Gott will" â€“ in der Fassung mit dem Durchgang auf der ersten Silbe[37]. Doch muss man bei diesem Bergleich in Mendelssohn "Choral" statt der Halben e' die sie Ã¼berlagernden Auftaktviertel als melodisch zugehÃ¶rig an- und das Abweichen ab der Zeilenmitte hinnehmen.

Pavadinimas	Felix Mendelssohn Bartholdy
Vertimas Anglų Išvertė Lein	Kalba, į kurią verčiama: Anglų The closing line corresponds just as well to that from â€œVon Himmel hochâ€; from this last one furthermore the second line matches almost completely, in addition it also contains short lines, which however differ melodically in their descending minor third. Short lines are not unusual at all; they also appear for example in "Was Gott tut, "Wachet auf", "Straf mich nicht", "Mache dich, mein Geist" and "Herzlich lieb hab ich dich". A generally recognized model for the first line is considered to be "Was mein Gott will" - in the version with the passage on the first syllable [37]. However, in this comparison one should consider, instead of the half E1 in Mendelssohn's "Chorale", the overlapping fourths on the upbeat to be melodically related and the deviation to begin in the middle of the line.
Pastabos apie vertimą	â€˜Ruf-Terzenâ€™, also called cuckoo terts, has been translated as 'descending minor third' here (thank you kafetzou!) "E1" is the E above high C.

Validated by kafetzou - 20 rugpjūtis 2008 03:42

Paskutinės žinutės

	Autorius	Pranešimas
		13 rugpjūtis 2008 18:14
	Lein Žinučių kiekis: 3389	There are a few things I'm struggling with here: I just don't know what Ruf-Terzen are. Same for Halben e'. I reckon it's a musical key but I don't know which one. Overlapping: wouls another word be better here? Superimposed? Any other suggestions? Not sure what word to use in the last sentence. Accept? Take?
		13 rugpjūtis 2008 18:20
	milkman Žinučių kiekis: 773	Thanks Lein! I think I get the gist of it
		13 rugpjūtis 2008 18:50
	italo07 Žinučių kiekis: 1474	I have no idea of music! But I googled "Rufterze" and it deals with pentatonic scale (look at the German page, too). I don't know what "halbes e'" in English would be. overlapping, maybe "overlaid"? I don't know. "accept" is a good translation for "hinnehmen".
		14 rugpjūtis 2008 07:05
	kafetzou Žinučių kiekis: 7963	An "e" is a note. A half e' must be like a half sharp or a half flat, but I don't know what the apostrophe means. Eine Terz = a third (in music), but I don't know what eine Rufterz is.
		14 rugpjūtis 2008 07:16
	kafetzou Žinučių kiekis: 7963	Also, I think Viertel should be "fourth" rather than "quarter" here. Doch muss man bei diesem Bergleich in Mendelssohn "Choral" statt der Halben e' die sie Ã¼berlagernden Auftaktviertel als melodisch zugehÃ¶rig an- und das Abweichen ab der Zeilenmitte hinnehmen. = In fact, in this comparison, one should consider, instead of the half e' in Mendelssohn's "Chorale", the opening note a fourth above it to belong melodically and the change to begin in the middle of the line. That's my interpretation, anyhow.
		14 rugpjūtis 2008 07:28
	kafetzou Žinučių kiekis: 7963	OK - a little more research about "Rufterz" brought me to this page, where the Rufterz is given as another word for Kuckucksterz (cuckoo third?), and the notes are given as G-E-G-G-E. I did find "cuckoo third" on a few websites, but they were German ones, written in English. I would say let's go ahead and use "cuckoo third", but then define it in the comments.
		14 rugpjūtis 2008 07:34
	kafetzou Žinučių kiekis: 7963	Ah wait - I found something better here: "the descending minor third ("sol-mi". In German music language, it's sometimes named the 'calling third' or 'cuckoo's third')" That was fun; now I can go to bed.
		14 rugpjūtis 2008 07:39
	kafetzou Žinučių kiekis: 7963	Nope - not yet. "e'" is apparently the e above middle c, also known as E4.
		14 rugpjūtis 2008 11:36
	italo07 Žinučių kiekis: 1474	iamfromaustria could help us but she is on vacation for 3 weeks. She plays piano.
		14 rugpjūtis 2008 17:45
	Lein Žinučių kiekis: 3389	Rufterzen e' (still not sure what 'half' means here and whether or not this would be the way to say it in English)
		14 rugpjūtis 2008 17:46
	Lein Žinučių kiekis: 3389	Here is my version after incorporation of some of your suggestions, kafetzou!
		14 rugpjūtis 2008 21:49
	milkman Žinučių kiekis: 773	Hey guys, please don't sweat it. It's clear enough now. Many thanks for all the help, Lein, italo, kafetzou
		15 rugpjūtis 2008 03:26
	kafetzou Žinučių kiekis: 7963	OK - I will accept it as is.
		19 rugpjūtis 2008 01:39
	jollyo Žinučių kiekis: 330	I'm sorry to bother after kafetzou's acceptance: - e' is in fact e1 (a typo according to milkman) - 'auftakt' should be 'prelude' or 'upbeat' which is different from just an opening fourth... - 'to differ' is 'verÃ¤ndern'; 'abweichen' is 'to deviate' Hope it helps.
		19 rugpjūtis 2008 06:16
	kafetzou Žinučių kiekis: 7963	I changed it, but I don't know what e1 is either.
		19 rugpjūtis 2008 23:30
	jollyo Žinučių kiekis: 330	"e1" is the e above the octavated middle c i.e. (middle)c-d-e-f-g-a-b-c1-d1-e1-.... (in Europe that is)
		20 rugpjūtis 2008 03:42
	kafetzou Žinučių kiekis: 7963	OK - I changed it and changed the note.